A&A Ep. 90
===
Karrie: [00:00:00] Welcome to Awakened and Alive After 40.
Dominique: If you're searching for inspiring and easy to apply Enneagram and Human Design content, then you've come to the right place. We're your hosts, Dominique
Karrie: and Karrie. Two friends and coaches who are passionate about sharing our knowledge and insights on these two powerful self awareness systems to help you step outside the box and into a life that is true to who you really are.
Dominique: We're so grateful to have you here. Let's jump into today's episode.
Karrie: Hello everyone and welcome back to the Awakened and Alive After 40 podcast. Dominique and I are so excited about today's episode because we have a guest on who, for me, this is a little bit of a full circle moment because when I first started learning and studying about the Enneagram, I decided I needed [00:01:00] to have a typing session done, and she is the Enneagram expert who did my typing session. This was three years ago, I believe. Even at that time, I did not know she was going to be the one to do my typing session because I signed up through my Enneagram certification program for the typing session. And I didn't know she was working with Kristi, my Enneagram teacher. When I saw that she was going to be the one doing my typing session, I had a little bit of like a celebrity moment because for me she was like an Instagram celebrity because I had been following her for so long. But we are so excited to welcome Gabrielle Westbrook onto our podcast today. She is one of my favorite people to follow on social media. She is a wealth of wisdom and information and we are so excited to talk with her because both Dominique and I have discovered so many similarities that we all have and the first one is that we are all three Projectors in Human Design, which is super exciting because when [00:02:00] Projectors get together I think we all just connect very easily.
Dominique: Yeah. Absolutely. And on top of that Gabrielle and I share the same profile, 1/3, and Karrie, you've got the 1 in there, and we've talked so much about how we just really thrive off of knowledge and learning. With all of us here having probably quite a few certifications thrown in the mix, this is just going to be such great conversation. I know we had Kristi on not too long ago. So this is exciting for me to see the people that you've really been mentored through in your life, Karrie. Gabrielle is one of those that you've talked so fondly of. I'm so incredibly grateful to have you here today, Gabrielle. So welcome.
Gabrielle: Well, thank you. What an introduction. I'm like blushing over here. No, that was so sweet. And I just, I laugh because Karrie, what you said, just like finding me on Instagram, that's how I meet all of my clients and the [00:03:00] people that join my membership program and things. And so it's just funny to hear that. I'm like, I'm just, I'm just me. Like, you know, I don't know. It's just really funny to hear. So anyways, I'm excited to be here.
Karrie: Yeah, I'm sure people on Instagram don't realize that people sort of see them as these quote unquote celebrity figures. But it's like, you feel like you get to know these people, but they have no idea who you are. And so it's this interesting dynamic when you actually sort of meet the people in real life or through technology or whatever.
Dominique: Now have you guys met in real life or
Gabrielle: Well just the typing session.
Dominique: Okay. Yeah. Because Karrie and I have never met in real life, in person, which we laugh about. We think it's pretty fantastic. The connection that you can create with individuals across the world with this technology and social media. Yeah. I certainly have things I don't like about it, but what a beautiful thing. Like we're all here connecting at this level.
Karrie: We are also excited today to talk to Gabrielle specifically about her [00:04:00] very powerful, interesting niche way of coaching and what she coaches in. First, I would love for you to just tell us a little bit about your professional background and what led you on to your coaching path that you're currently doing now.
Gabrielle: Yeah. It's a full circle thing for me because I was an athlete my whole life. I went to college for exercise physiology. Like I was just very much into the physical body realm, and I got into personal training. I wasn't sure exactly what I wanted to do, so I started with personal training, but I ended up really loving it. I had my own business. I would go to women's home and train them in their homes, and I loved it. What I really loved about it was the connection piece, like the talking about the things and also seeing the women transform. I really, really loved that too. But over a couple of years of doing that, I got to this place where I was at that point certified as a postpartum fitness specialist, and so I really want to work with moms. I want to help them recover their sense of self [00:05:00] as they are moving into motherhood. And at that point I was thinking like, okay, I'd want to start a podcast and all these things. Then I was like, but I wouldn't want to talk about fitness in this podcast. I'd want to talk about the real life things and not that fitness isn't real life, but you know what I mean? Like just the deeper things. I also started to realize with my clients, they'd be in amazing shape, but they still felt like shit about themselves. And I'm like, huh, I can't train that out of them with fitness. And so anyways, it kind of just sent me on this, like, just paying attention to all of that, noticing all of that. Then we moved to Austin and two months into living here, I broke my leg. I couldn't walk for three months. I had two surgeries. It was like a complete shift of my life. Like I was so used to training and fitness and all of these things, and I was just on a couch. And I'm like, Oh, um, okay. Well, what do I do with this? And I just remember thinking like, okay, you have yourself and you have your journal. What are you going to do with this time? Because you can't go anywhere, can't do anything. I had learned about the [00:06:00] Enneagram maybe a year before that time, and so I was just really diving deep into that, gotten an email from Beth McCord where I got my certification. Hey, I'm starting another round of Enneagram certification. And I was just like, all right, let's try that. So anyways, that's kind of what led me into then going on the path that I'm on now where I got certified as an Enneagram coach, And I always knew I wanted to use that. I didn't want that to be like the main thing that I did, but I knew that I wanted to use that within really the coaching that I always wanted to do was helping women heal like the deeper pain, the emotional trauma, inner child work. I kind of just took one step after the other with that and got new certifications along the way and started my coaching business in March of 2020. So that's kind of led me to today.
Dominique: Wow. That is fascinating. As I'm listening to you, Gabrielle, so much of it sounds very similar to my own path into coaching as a physical therapist assistant that has been working with [00:07:00] patients for 20 years now and reaching a point where I was noticing patients were coming to me not only of course because of the physical ailments and situations they were dealing with but the emotional support that they were craving and in need of and weren't getting it from doctors or their loved ones or even from other therapists in the clinic. So I found that there was this theme of my patients coming to me and really just needing more of the emotional support to help them through the process. And then that's when I started thinking like, wow, okay, I want to do more than just the physical therapy side, the physical health side of things. I want to help people process what I came to realize was a lot of unresolved trauma, a lot of disconnect within the household and needing a safe space to express themselves. So that's fantastic. I love that it kind of sounds like a similar path and a very beautiful one.
Gabrielle: Yeah, I realized I said at the [00:08:00] beginning, like a full circle moment and I didn't follow up on that, but that full circle moment for me was like, I remember learning about the nervous system, the brain, the body, but it was more on the anatomy side. It was more on the exercise physiology side. And now I, over the years, have somatic trauma therapy, somatic parts work, and like really getting into the somatic work, the nervous system work, polyvagal theory, like all these things from the emotional healing side of things. And that is what lights me up so much. And that was the missing piece that I didn't have that I have now. So like you said, that deeper support.
Dominique: Yeah. Yeah. And I love seeing that it's coming around more into the health field now, too, because I still work in the clinic, and I have patients coming in saying like, yeah, so I've been hearing about vagus nerve and I've been working on vagus nerve regulation with patients. I do the polyvagal theory at work as well, just kind of on my own time. It's not anything that I bill for, unfortunately. That's a big problem. But I [00:09:00] incorporate a lot of it because people, doctors, practitioners are coming around to understanding that connection. There's no separation to the mind and body. Like it is one and that just really lights me up. I get excited to see that now in the healthcare field being spoken about more.
Gabrielle: I bet. I bet. It's needed for sure.
Karrie: It's so interesting also that both of you are Enneagram Type 9s, which is a body type in the Centers of Intelligence, and you both gravitated early in your career decision making toward body-centered careers. And then you both realized you wanted more, which I think part of the Enneagram Type 9 growth path is this sort of sense of enlightenment. I always see Type 9s who are really in a good space, as these really sort of guru-like enlightened people. And that's sort of how I see both of you, that you're both on this path toward that. It's just really, really fascinating to me that body [00:10:00] types tend to love working in body-centered fields.
Gabrielle: I get chills when you say that because I feel so seen when you say that. I'm like, yes, it's like, it's so true. It's so real. I see that with a lot of other Type 9s as well. And I don't know if, Dominique, I don't know if you feel this way, but it's like, I've had to like really work through the shame of, wanting to be in that space. Because I think like you said Karrie we start out in these body-centered kind of fields, but it seems like kind of commonplace, normal. Like oh this is the only option I really have and then being able to expand and when you grow and especially as a 9 really reclaiming your sense of self and then you see these other more niche, a little bit more hidden, not as accepted topics that we want to dive into. It's like I really had to wrestle with just coming to acceptance of doing it, even if I wasn't getting the positive affirmation back for those things.
Dominique: Yeah. I know what you mean about that too, Gabrielle. Right away, it makes me think that [00:11:00] as Projectors, or in Quantum language Orchestrators, we're here to see things that others don't see. We're here to see the new ways, the healthier ways of doing things, the outside of the box way of doing things. And that's how I felt when I was starting to talk about vagus nerve, nervous system regulation in my clinic and people are like, uh, what like what's all this woo woo stuff you're talking about? I'm like, no, no, legit. Like you have to start with body before you can move on from there into mind, muscle activity, anything like that. It's in the nervous system first. So I felt like I was alone a lot of the times because I just saw these things that other people weren't catching on to yet. As a physical therapy assistant, I was like, I can't start a coaching business. This is all I know. How do I do a coaching business? And so I made a lot of excuses, just not knowing any better for a long time until I realized, okay, wait a minute. No, I need to be someone to start this [00:12:00] conversation, to be one of the few right now. It's tough, right? It's tough knowing something is so true and so right and not having everyone else see that just yet.
Gabrielle: Yeah, just speaking to that Projector soul because that feeling is so deep and that feeling can be so painful, you know, what you said about, we're supposed to be the thinkers outside of the box and the guides to that thing. Especially as a 9, when you already don't have a strong foundation in your sense of self, and then you're not getting that from other people, it can feel like, oh, I just need to shut this down, this isn't good, this isn't right, this is gonna make me lose connection with these people, and I would die if that happened. So, yeah, there's a lot, there's a lot there.
Dominique: Yeah. Yeah. And I'll get into it shortly, but within your body graph, there's a lot that kind of connects to that and how that makes sense, that feeling of the fear and being without connection or support [00:13:00] and direction and belonging. So yeah, we'll get into that more.
Karrie: Gabrielle, we also wanted to ask, because I think that your particular niche right now is so needed and important in the coaching community, and that is your work with women who have experienced betrayal trauma, and just maybe speak a little bit about that, why this work is so important to you, why you're so passionate about it.
Gabrielle: Yeah. Yeah. It is a topic that feels like such a big part of my purpose, because I feel like when I speak about betrayal, when I have experienced it, gone through it myself, I wasn't getting the help, I did not feel seen, I did not feel understood, and so won't dive too deep, but a little bit is I experienced betrayal trauma myself, and when I say there's so many forms of betrayal, right? But when I speak of what I went through and what I work with, when I work with women, it's sexual betrayal trauma. So that's if you ever experienced in a relationship, a romantic relationship, when your partner has either [00:14:00] had a physical affair, an emotional affair, porn addiction, sex addiction, love addiction, and they act outside of your relationship and betray you. I went through that with my husband. He has a porn addiction and a sex addiction. And so that played a huge part in our early marriage, our early relationship, early marriage. I felt so crazy. There were things that I just didn't know that were happening behind the scenes. I felt like if I did open up to anyone, it was just kind of like, pity, which I hated, or it was like, they didn't know how to respond, or even if I went to a professional, it was kind of like, well, you're codependent, so you're the reason why you keep hitting your head off the same wall. And I was just like, oh my god, like, it was the most crazy-making experience, and I walked through that for like, five years married and two years like before that. And there was a lot there. Everyone's like, why didn't you leave and all those things, but it didn't seem bad enough, quote unquote, especially with a [00:15:00] porn addiction. It didn't seem bad enough. It wasn't physically cheating, and this is just what men do, and you just got to accept it. Like there's all those narratives. I came to realize like, no, I don't have to accept that. And so anyways, it was shortly after I broke my leg, and I just was like, this is my life too, I'm not gonna do this anymore. I'm not gonna tolerate this, I'm not gonna continue to be treated this way, and that was like the first time I really put my foot down, and was like, no, something has to change, and I don't know if that means we're gonna stay together or not. So I kind of took this approach to my healing of, I had this visual from a video I saw from Esther Perel, I don't know if you know who she is. She does a lot of work with infidelity space. And she had this video and it's her TED talk and it was basically the last couple minutes that really spoke to me, and she said she had couples come into her office and she said, You could get divorced, and you could get into a second relationship, and you could get divorced from that relationship and get into a third relationship. But what if we could, and I'm not saying verbatim what she said, this is how I interpreted it, what if you could divorce from that [00:16:00] relationship, and create an opportunity for a second relationship together. That really was like the counterintuitive the missing piece thing that I just was like, oh, this makes sense. And so from there I had this visual of this house and this house was my marriage. And it looked great on the outside, but inside, everything was cracking and breaking and leaking, and we kept trying to put all these band aids on these things that never worked. And then when you looked deeper at it, the foundation was cracked. And it's like, well, you don't keep trying to repair the same house on a cracked foundation. So what do you have to do? You have to demolish that house. You have to like tear that house down and it doesn't mean all the memories go with it. Some of the memories you can bring with you, but you have to demolish that house. You also have to rip out the foundation. And then for me, what I kind of took from that is, then we each have to stand on either side of our plot, to say like, I'm going to pull out my wreckage. You're going to pull out your wreckage, and we're going to do that individual work for some time. We're not going to make a decision to stay or go [00:17:00] yet. We're just gonna stay in this container, but we're gonna become safer We're gonna become healthier healing people. And then at that point we're gonna say, okay do we want to pour another foundation together? Do we want to build another house together or not? And so that literally set the trajectory of what our healing was and that's the approach that I take with my clients because it just adds the nuance and the gray space and the complexity that this kind of topic really deserves because it's not as simple as just stay or go. That brings way more anxiety to women. And in my theory and my approach is it's different for every single person and it's so nuanced. And there is a lot that you have to learn in that time about yourself, so that's a lot of what I help women do is like, I want you to come to know and believe that you will be okay no matter what happens to the relationship. The relationship's a byproduct. Let's start inwardly. I went through that, and now I help women but with the somatic and the nervous system approach because obviously this is trauma that we're dealing with.
Dominique: [00:18:00] Wow. Thank you so much for sharing your story with us. That was a lot it sounds like, a lot to work through and the rebuilding, like you said, it looks different for everyone. There's no one way to do it. There's no right way or wrong way. There's just your way.
Gabrielle: Yes.
Dominique: Right?
Gabrielle: Yes.
Dominique: Thank you. Thank you for sharing that.
Karrie: I got chills while you were talking because I love hearing Type 9s step into their anger and their power, and that is what you did. You took control of your life. You realize I have anger that needs to be expressed, and I have power to create the life I want and deserve.
Gabrielle: Yeah, that anger piece, that's why I like using the Enneagram in my coaching is because anger is going to look different for all the different types, but speaking as a 9, personally, yes. That piece of it was the key, honestly. Like, there was so much repressed [00:19:00] anger, and I had to actually face it and encounter it and dance with it and sit with it and let it flow, let it rip. And then also not worrying about if it was the healthy way to express it, just expressing it. And then over time learning how to do it with more choice and intention. But I couldn't do that piece until I let it rip first, you know?
Dominique: Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Yeah. I'm curious to hear if any of our listeners right now are like, oh my gosh, this sounds like me, I'm in this boat right now, what would you advise someone on for that first step toward this whole process, if they are wanting to seek some sort of change and assistance in their own life?
Gabrielle: Yeah. Oof. This is tough just because it does really vary on that person's situation. But I would say like, without a doubt, no matter what the situation is, you have to get support, whether it's therapy. I would [00:20:00] recommend working with someone who specializes in partners of betrayal. My previous therapist that I worked with was a CSAT, a Certified Sex Addiction Therapist, but she also was a partner of betrayal, so she had the knowledge of what the betrayer's going through, but also working with the partners too, just someone who specializes in the partner of betrayal work. If you're not ready for therapy, get into a support group. I didn't even know these things existed, but support groups for partners of betrayal do exist. I run one now. I felt so alone for so long, and it was like, that was the first step I took. And now I run one. So I would just say, get support in whatever way you can, not just friends and family, because friends and family aren't gonna know they're not. Also they're going to have different bias and different opinions. So that would be the first thing I would say. And the second thing I would say is, well, I would also couple with that, make sure you're seeing someone who is willing to understand you. And don't just go with the first person you go with because there can be a lot of re injury there, so just make sure you like, get choosy with who you see and who you get support with. [00:21:00] The second thing I would say is, as best as you can, slow down everything in your life. I know some women can't. I know some women feel like they can't in terms of like, I have kids, I have a job, like, these things, and yes, but are there other plates? Maybe you're used to being the friend that is always so supportive with your friends. Maybe that's not your season right now. Right? Maybe it's not your season to be volunteering and all the things that maybe you want to do, and there's some grieving there, but as best as you can, stop all the unnecessary spinning plates. Slow down without guilt, without shame, and give yourself some time, some breathing room, and some space. And I would say, those two are probably, foundationally, the most important first.
Dominique: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I, I would definitely agree. And I like to say, date your therapist or potential therapist. There's so many times I've come across someone they're like, yeah, I started going to therapy. I don't know if it's working for me. I don't think I'm going to do it anymore. And then I asked them, how do you feel [00:22:00] about your therapist? Do you feel safe? Do you feel seen, heard? And sometimes it's like, yeah, no, not really. I'm like, okay, go to a different one. Date around with your therapist if you really need to, if you're not feeling that connection. And then the second part you mentioned, Gabrielle, I think of Jess Massey. She is a productivity coach and someone, Karrie and I really enjoy following just because she has such amazing nuggets of wisdom. She talks about as you're juggling life, glass balls and rubber balls. So if you're dropping a glass ball, that's going to just shatter, that's going to create complete chaos in your life. Of course, if you drop a rubber ball, like you were saying, if you're saying yes to too many friend outings or something like that, that rubber ball drops, it's going to bounce back. So prioritizing if you feel like you have such a busy life and you're just keeping yourself busy and just on constant go mode, thinking about what are my glass balls and what are my rubber balls? How can I shift that focus so I'm not paying so much [00:23:00] attention to the things that don't really matter or nurture me in this season?
Gabrielle: Yeah. And that's a big thing too, 'cause especially as women and especially the women that I work with, a lot of them, I mean, it really does vary, but like a lot of women do have kids and a lot of women that I work with are stay at home moms too. I'm like, get creative, right? They're like, well, I have to clean my house, but I have no energy. I have to do the laundry, but I have no energy. And there's a shame component if they can't do these things. And so it's even the daily life things that I help women try to think creatively. Can you hire someone to come clean your house once a week, once a month, to help you in this time, right? Like we have to think creatively, and I understand why women get so, I felt the same way, so trapped and so stuck in these cycles because we're in either a sympathetic dominant state right now or a dorsal dominant state right now, and it's hard to think creatively in those states. And so yeah, it's really meeting women where their nervous system is at to really figure it out for them.
Dominique: What a beautiful support system you've become for so many women, [00:24:00] it sounds like.
Karrie: Yeah, your group community that you've created looks amazing and I've always been like, oh my gosh, if I go through anything like this, it's like the first place I would want to go, I think.
Gabrielle: Yeah, I created Afterglow, this August will be two years of Afterglow's existence. It's a support group and a mentorship group for women healing after betrayal, and I love it so much because it is such a safe community. I set very strict boundaries and some guidelines because I didn't want it to become this like rah, rah, hate men, we're so angry group. I wanted it to be about you. It's about your healing. It's not about that. I love it so much. I get to show up as myself. I'm not just the coach in the group too, which is cool. I get to share a lot of what I'm going through with them and they show up for me, which is so beautiful. It's become a very safe anchoring tethering thing in my life and even the women in the community, I get a lot of feedback about that. We don't have to feel as alone and isolated as long as I did. That's kind of why I created the group, 'cause I'm like, I was on an island for way too [00:25:00] long unnecessarily. So it's been beautiful.
Dominique: I can't help but just picture your chart in my mind right now. I would love to jump in...
Gabrielle: Let's dive in!
Dominique: Sharing your chart just because so much of these beautiful shares are hitting with what you're here to do with your life. I would love to share my screen so we can take a look at your chart if that's okay with you.
Gabrielle: Yes! Let's do it. I get excited about this stuff, especially as a Projector. I'm like, Ooh, see me. What's up? What's going on with this?
Dominique: Yep. Yep. You get it. So I went ahead and I pulled your chart up. As we've already talked about, you're a Projector. So you're someone who is here to not necessarily work like the standard 9 to 5 job. Seventy percent of the population is here to actually do the physical work of creating and building our world. But as Projectors, we're here to really serve those around us as guides, as support, helping them to [00:26:00] better use their own energy and to be smart about how we use energy. That's the first thing with being a Projector is that we don't have that consistent resource of energy to keep us going, going, going all day long. We have open Sacral Center. Every Projector has the open Sacral, and that's the workforce and life force energy. Really being wise about energy is one of our gifts. And why working through shame and guilt around not having the energy to do things, like you were just saying, so many of your clients feel shameful if they don't have the ability to take care of the house, the kids, the family, and they find that they're feeling burnt out. That's very much a thing with being a Projector is being wise about it and picking your battles, picking where to focus your attention, so that way you're keeping your resources and your reserve full so that you can give to others. Now, with everything you're talking [00:27:00] about with safety and connection and helping women through processing the shame and fears, that brings my attention right to the Spleen Center, which is the bottom left. You have it completely open. Our open centers are where we absorb energy from others and amplify it. So we feel things more intensely than someone who might have a defined center. And the Spleen Center is all about well being, all about the nervous system, the sense of safety and connection with others. Timing is also another one. The shadow side could be holding on to things for too long. And that could be physical items, relationships, feelings, beliefs. When we're stuck in the shadow side of the Spleen, it's the inability to let things go, and that can come with a lot of fears and anxieties because of being fearful of what if I don't have enough? What could [00:28:00] the future hold for me? What if I repeat the past? What if I fail? These are all the gates that we see here. But with you having that completely open Spleen, you are here to guide others through releasing fears. Your wisdom is in this center and what makes you such a beautiful coach is because you know fear, you know anxiety, you know what it is to have the sense of something not being right for you because you feel it so deeply and you have over the years. So your gift is now to guide others through releasing these things and processing these strong emotions with anxieties and fears. How does that resonate with you?
Gabrielle: Yeah. I feel like you just read my journal of like, what has happened over the span of my life. Really, the deep, deep things that I've had to navigate and even still wrestle with.
Dominique: Yes. Oh, yeah.
Gabrielle: Yeah. It was a joke as a little girl of like, oh, her middle name's Worry. [00:29:00] Yeah. I've always struggled with such intense fear of a lot of it being about self-preservation, a lot of it being about safety, and you said timing and I'm kind of curious what you mean by timing.
Dominique: So with the Spleen Center, what they say is that if it's open, then we have a more fluid sense of timing. So that can be like being super late to places or because you're aware that you could be late, you're super early, so it's like, you try to be aware of timing with certain things because you know that it's kind of all over the place. It's not this hard sense. If I looked at the clock right now, I would probably be surprised that it was 11:50 because it feels later to me. I have an open Spleen, so for me, that's kind of how my Spleen is. I don't have much awareness of time and I also have been diagnosed with ADD, but with the Spleen Center, that's that awareness. And someone who has a defined Spleen Center, often has a better [00:30:00] connection to time itself. And also when we think of time, it's instinctual, right? The Spleen is the instincts. And so if it's open, we have such variety and variation to it. So if something is pinging us in the moment, we may be like, Oh, maybe that was a, yeah, that thing. And maybe it wasn't. And we kind of let the moment go by. Whereas oftentimes with a defined Spleen, they're much more aware of in the moment. We're kind of more all over the place, flowing with time.
Gabrielle: Okay, that resonates a lot with me. For me, a big struggle in my life is I'm constantly trying to figure out what's the best time to do things, like in my day, like chronological time ordering of what makes the most sense. But it, like, causes a lot of stress and aggravation and conflict inside of me.
Dominique: Yeah. And that could be potentially like your way of feeling in control of the timing of things in your life. If there is a fear around that [00:31:00] or a discomfort around the unknown, potentially. So it could be part of that too. But you also have here, the open Sacral Center, which we all have as Projectors. And so this means that we can oftentimes work harder than Generators because we're absorbing and amplifying that energy. But because it's not ours to hold on to, that's when we can be at greater risk for burning ourselves out and having some pretty serious health issues because of that. So the other two centers, the Will Center, this tiny triangle and the G Center, this is where the heart chakra split and became two separate centers. And so the Will Center is all about self worth, self value. With someone who has an open Will Center, the potential shadow side could be trying to do as much as you can and be somebody different or prove your worthiness. Yeah. And value. Yep. Therefore sometimes burning yourself out because you're putting [00:32:00] others first or you're just in this mode of needing to prove yourself to feel of value.
Gabrielle: Yeah. That's been a big theme in my life for sure.
Dominique: Yeah. And again, because that's wide open, just like the Spleen, that's where through your experiences and through your growth, that's where your power is that now you get to help people through their process. You have so much wisdom of your experiential learning over the years, that's your gift now to give to others. It seems, oftentimes, like when you're in it, of course, you're just like, ugh, why? But with that strength and with that knowledge and experience you've gained, like that's now your powerhouse there. That's the beauty about open centers. And with your G Center, that's our center for love, direction, connection to self. This is also where something called the magnetic monopole resides, and this is what attracts our experiences into our life. So if we find ourselves as pure value because we exist, if we see [00:33:00] the value in ourselves and know that we don't have to prove ourselves, and then we find that hey I'm lovable for just being me, when we vibrate this energy of pure love and acceptance, this is when we start to pull those experiences into our lives with that magnetic monopole residing here in the G Center. So you're really here to help guide women through, whether it's their purpose or a direction in life, with the G Center, to find the value and worthiness in their inherent being. They were born with that. It's nothing to earn or nothing that you need to acquire over time. And then with the Spleen Center being strong to release things that are no longer serving you, to work through the fears and anxiety, to feel them. That's the important thing too, with the Spleen, they say, feel the fear and do it anyway. And with the nervous system work you're doing, you're helping them to find safety in their body so they can push through the different fears that come about from the [00:34:00] gates and the Spleen here. All while, they're nurturing their energy, they're nurturing their life force, and knowing that it's okay to rest. You're allowed to. This is what is going to help you through all of the process, through the grief, the trauma, resolving everything that builds up over the years of going through the things like you went through, Gabrielle, and what you help women through.
Gabrielle: Yeah. Well, that was so beautifully said, and I'm so glad this is recorded so that I could come back and listen to that often. Parts of me, especially as a 9, like, seeing myself in this way, it's hard sometimes, and it's almost like that part of me kind of anesthetizes it a little bit, and like you said, that part, the self value, the self...
Dominique: Yeah, the Will Center there. Yes. Yeah. Self worth and value.
Gabrielle: Yeah.
Dominique: Yeah. Absolutely. I'm glad that this resonates for you. I know I spent a good time here, so I want to just chat like real quick about your profile, because you're a 1/3. I'm a 1/3, and [00:35:00] the 1/3 is known as The Resource, The Knowledge Seeker, the one just really dive deep into the topics that you're passionate about. My mentor says that the internet was created for the 1s out there. I don't know about you, but I'm like, ooh, I want to learn more about this. Let me hop online and see what Google has to say.
Gabrielle: Of course, yes.
Dominique: Karrie, I know you're the same with you having a 1 as well. So like these topics, whether it's nervous system regulation, and you're like, I need to learn more about this. So you dive down the rabbit hole. And then the 3 is all about The Explorer in the Quantum language, because it's known as The Martyr in traditional, which I think that's a horrible word to describe the 3 because we're here to then take that knowledge and experiment with it. You don't know if something's going to work for you or for others until you try it. Then you get to decide like, okay, this really makes a difference. I want to share this with the world now. And so that 1/3, I've grown to [00:36:00] really love that about myself, whereas, with the 3, we can often feel guilt or blame or shame about messing up, making mistakes. And there are no mistakes for the 3. There's only lessons.
Karrie: Hey there, friend. Have you signed up for the Awakened and Alive newsletter yet? If not, we want to invite you to get on the list so you don't miss out on the exciting new offerings we have planned for 2024.
Dominique: By receiving the weekly newsletter, you'll be the first to hear when new episodes drop along with updates on a very special project we've been working on for our amazing community.
Gabrielle: Yeah. Are we allowed to swear on this podcast?
Dominique: Oh, yeah.
Gabrielle: Okay. I'm like I told you I'm working with Amy Lee for business coaching and she's a Projector. She works with Projectors. And so I've been diving into this specific piece a lot in my coaching. Her motto for me right now is fuck around and find out, because I get [00:37:00] so caught up in the perfectionism and the is this right is this wrong, and then I end up freezing, and I end up not doing anything. So that 3 piece of me is I think really not developed. I think there's a fear there. I think there's this. Oh, no, am I gonna make a mistake? Oh, no, what if this fails? Oh, no, what if i'm seen? Oh, no, what if I succeed? Right? Like there's all that side of it, too. So yeah, she has been helping me to see like being messy, allowing myself to be messier, is gonna be a lot of my growth in this piece.
Dominique: It's so hard though, isn't it?
Gabrielle: Yeah!
Dominique: It's hard, but so, so much truth to that. And then with the 1, the shadow side is the fear of not knowing enough.
Gabrielle: Yeah. Oof. Yeah.
Dominique: Okay. So you've got fear of not knowing, and then the 3 fear of making mistakes. So talk about being in a freeze state, perfectionism, right? And then on top of that, you got that open Spleen, so you're feeling all of the fears a lot more intensely. And so that's a lot of, [00:38:00] we have conundrums in the chart that we like to say. So that's what you're here to learn. This is one of the big lessons that you're here to learn is to know it's okay to make mistakes, to feel the fear and do it anyway, to be able to push through that by creating safety within your nervous system and regulating it and teaching others to do the same. Lastly, I would love, Karrie to chime in on this one because you both have the same conscious sun, the Gate 23, which in the Quantum language is known as the Gate of Transmission. In traditional language, it's the Gate of Assimilation. And so the 23 just kind of in a nutshell is you're here to simplify complex topics. You're here to make things, especially when it comes to the body, how many everyday individuals are familiar with the body and the role of the nervous system and all of that juicy stuff that we love. So you simplify it for them, so that they can better understand and not be so fearful potentially [00:39:00] in ways of what comes with not understanding the body and why they're experiencing things that they are experiencing. So I'm just so curious to know between you, Gabrielle, and Karrie, how that 23 plays out because the conscious sun, that's where everything else in the chart funnels up and through it. So it's this expression of just simplifying things in your life and trusting that you're gonna know what you need to know when you need to know it, and it's a teaching gate. It's a need to feel heard. You're full of great ideas, but it's all around timing, especially as a Projector, being recognized and invited to share. So you've got all this knowledge, all this amazingness in your head, and in your experience to share, but it's also waiting for the right people to recognize it before you can share it with those who are ready to hear what you have to say. So how does that play out in your life, Gabrielle? How does that feel?
Gabrielle: The biggest [00:40:00] example that comes to mind, and I'm just gonna share this because it's the way that I can explain it the best. When I started healing after betrayal, I didn't know all the polyvagal theory stuff. I wasn't certified in it. I wasn't knowledgeable about it. Like, I literally had no idea about it. And so I think, this came about so organically and naturally. That's what I love about this part of me is because there are these things that I inherently know, and then I learn about them later in a text or something, and I'm like, oh my gosh. This is what I've been saying. This is what I know. So my example is, before I even knew all this, like, the first three months after betrayal, and I'm like, frantic, sympathetic, fight or flight, like, trying to figure out what just blew up in my life. I was also fighting actually slowing down. I was fighting, like, the depression that I was really feeling from this massive eruption in my life. I had someone reflect that back to me, like, maybe you are depressed, maybe you do need to slow down. And I was like, okay. So I was navigating that. Anyways, I remember it was after my second leg surgery, so I'm sitting on the couch again, and I [00:41:00] had this thought of if I'm a sliding scale vertically, like, I want to feel here, I want to feel high, I want to feel all the good, positive, fun emotions, but I'm feeling really low right now. I'm feeling embarrassed, ashamed, awful, low energy, fatigue. But while I'm here, I'm putting on guilt, and I'm putting on shame, and I'm putting on shoulds and supposed tos. And so, while I'm piling all this stuff on myself, while I'm already low, I'm always gonna come up against that. There's no room for me to even go up to the positive feeling emotions. And so I realized in that moment, okay, while I'm low, I'm not going anywhere, so I gotta start taking off the guilt, the shame, the shoulds, the supposed tos, the blame. And I need to just let myself be here in order to naturally, organically move up to where I want to be. What I'm essentially explaining is polyvagal theory, and I had no idea that that was a thing. And I actually just moved through it myself, so I like, had this simplified kind of download, if you will. I moved through it [00:42:00] myself. I found that it works, and then, like, two years later, learned about it in the more scientific, researched sense. It just was one of those moments where I'm like, oh, this has always happened in my life. I love that about me. And I'm really good at explaining it, and women understand it really well in that way, and I don't even have to go into, this is polyvagal theory, and let's fill out the textbook stuff. Anyways, so that's a big example of how that kind of plays out in my life.
Dominique: Oh, that's beautiful. I love that you take the polyvagal theory, that knowledge, and put it into language that is just simply, like, language of explaining how someone can move through things without them knowing, like, oh, this is science, and this is complex, and how am I going to remember all of this or learn this? So yeah, there you go. That's awesome. And with Karrie, Karrie and I joke that I get a little bit out there sometimes with my conversation and I love how she can reel it in and simplify it on the podcast when I do start getting [00:43:00] more into Quantum language. And we talked about this recently, but Karrie, when it comes to your side, like in the Enneagram world and what you've done in your professional life, how does that Gate 23 feel to you?
Karrie: Yeah. Like Gabrielle was saying, I really, really felt it when I worked in public education as a speech pathologist because we had meetings all the time where we're speaking to parents, and they don't understand all the nitty gritty details of the theory or the disability that their child has been diagnosed with or whatever it may be. I found that my role in all these meetings was always like speaking to a level and in a way that the parents heard and could digest and absorb, but also they felt super supported through it. And whatever teams I worked on would always comment on that about my style of communication during that time and just how well I could simplify this crazy [00:44:00] document that we're going over with all of this jargon and lingo in it. And I could just get it down to the basics that the parents needed to hear. And this is before I knew about Human Design, so I think, I've always heard, we need to not try to live our purpose or try to live our incarnation cross. We just have to allow ourselves to do what feels natural. Like Gabrielle was saying, this wasn't something she set out to try to do. And it's so funny, Gabrielle and I both have three defined channels in our charts, and two of the three for us are the same. And one of those is the 23-43 channel, which is known by... Dominique, what is it? Genius to freak or freak to genius.
Dominique: So yeah, it's the freak. Yes. Yeah. And that's the connection of the Ajna to the Throat. So you're here to speak your mind.
Karrie: And just hearing Gabrielle say that this is like a knowing channel where you just know something and you don't know how you know it, and you just knew Polyvagal Theory [00:45:00] before you learned it. And if you had maybe tried to describe it to some people, they would have been like, Gabrielle, what are you talking about, thinking you sounded freakish. But then other people who maybe invited you or were wanting to hear it or needing to hear it would see you as having this genius idea.
Gabrielle: Right. Good point.
Dominique: Yep. So well explained, Karrie. And that's why I love it because yes, that's where that connection is for sure of speaking your mind. And lastly, just so we can move on, I got a couple other questions for you, Gabrielle. You also have your authority as an emotional authority. So, through the 19-49 connection, and that means that you are not meant to make decisions like right on the spot. The best way to make decisions is by feeling through them, allowing the emotional wave, which, for you and Karrie, cause you both have this wave, it's kind of small undulating changes within how you're feeling [00:46:00] day to day, week to week. And so ideally if something is presented to you and you're trying to make a decision on it and you've got this strong yes initially, give it some time, give it a day, two days because no matter what your mood is whether you're on a great mood one day and then low mood, you still want it to feel like a yes And that's how you know something is going to be right for you. If it's kind of like, yes, one day, and then you're like, ah, nah, I don't think that's going to be right for me, then ideally that's where you want to kind of pull back and reconsider. But the emotional wave is something that is all about waiting things out, feeling through it and nobody likes to wait. Like every single one of us, when it comes to the chart is designed to wait and process decisions besides the sacral response, which is a quick like in the moment. But for you, that's how your authority works as an emotional authority.
Gabrielle: Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Yeah, that [00:47:00] was something I was shamed about a lot in my life just being so indecisive and being so well indecisive to the world's outlook on it, right? I was something I was definitely shamed about, and I had a lot of pressure on me to make decisions quickly and also like different guardrails were put up for me. I wasn't allowed to just like do how I do. And so I don't feel like I really learned my emotional wave until like the last few years of like allowing it to be what it actually is meant to be. And so, yeah, that's, something I still kind of battle with, but I am getting better. And I think even going back to that, question right before this. I firmly now know that like your body will always tell you when it's time, when it's ready, when in the next thing, or when to stop something. think for me now it's kind of been learning my emotional wave through that process and also really believing myself now, whereas before I wasn't really allowed or that skill wasn't developed. I didn't have the space to develop that skill. But I've always known it's within me, and so it's now just giving myself the permission [00:48:00] and the space to get in touch with it. So it's been a journey of allowing myself to be as I am. So
Dominique: Yeah, yeah, no, that's so true, and Karrie and I have talked just regarding her emotional wave that it's not judging what's coming up for you, just simply allowing it to be what it is. And what I love about Quantum Human Design is that as an emotional being with these waves, that's your mode to creativity, to creation. I mean you think about all the writers and poets and artists out there, how some of their best work is done in the melancholy and the depths of their sadness. And so it's kind of allowing it to be and being a screen and not a sponge is another one. Just observing, feeling, letting it pass, and then tapping in and asking yourself, okay, how do I feel now? What did I learn from that? How did I grow from that? It's a beautiful thing, but challenging, [00:49:00] like you said, yeah. When we've never been taught. But it's okay to feel differently from how others feel or even to have that connection to your body.
Gabrielle: Totally. And I also think as an Enneagram 9, just because that's where my expertise lies, it's like when I think about that, even for me, it was as big as like, I didn't even know I had a sense of self. And so even that, it's like so much energy to constantly have to check in with myself, like you said, how do I feel about it now? It's been draining to learn how to do that for myself.
Dominique: Yeah.
Gabrielle: And so sometimes I don't, and sometimes I'm not good at it even now. I think it's gonna be a lifelong process for me.
Dominique: Oh, absolutely. Yeah. I know I'm definitely one of those lifelongers too. So yeah, absolutely.
Karrie: Really quickly before we wrap up, we love asking our guests on our podcast just to discuss a couple of their core values because core values is a topic that comes up on a lot of our episodes. Dominique and I love discussing them. So Gabrielle, if you could just [00:50:00] let us know a couple of your core values, at this point in your life, because we talk about how they can be always changing with the season of life that we're in.
Gabrielle: Absolutely. Yeah, I don't know if you guys know of Lacy Phillips. She runs To Be Magnetic. So I've been a member of her membership program since 2019. And so she has this journaling practice I was telling you about. It's basically to like, get down to the root of like, what are your core values right now? And you can do it every three months, every six months, every year. I usually do it once a year and see if they've changed or if I want to add some, take some out. So anyways, it's Authentic Code. That's what she calls it, your authentic code. So right now in my life, my authentic code, it's basically four pillars and I have some like definitions for each of them. But my first one is health. So physical wellness, healthy food, making sure I have the right doctors in my life, different wellness services, things like that. So health, number one. Number two, emotional wellness. So [00:51:00] this consists of healing trauma, feeling regulated, able to connect with myself and connect with others. The third one is expansion. So for me, what this means is freedom to be myself, freedom to feel seen and understood, possibilities, opportunities, being my version of creative. And then lastly, my fourth pillar is comfort. And what I mean by this is rest, luxury, slow, feeling good in my body, feeling good in my clothes, inner child feeling at home, and feeling safe in my relationships.
Dominique: Oh my gosh. I love that. Maybe we can link that in the show notes if you're able to provide us with a way that our listeners can maybe find their way to this exercise. That would be awesome.
Gabrielle: Yeah. It's been really impactful. Like I said, I usually do it once a year and this last time I did it at the end of last year, and I would say these still feel really true right now. But these are all four very different than what my [00:52:00] values were in 2019, 2020. So it's really, it's kind of cool to see it documented and do that over your life.
Dominique: Now do you go back and look at how your core values have changed? Like you mentioned you do some journaling. So do you ever go back or is it just kind of like a one and done and just keep moving forward with it?
Gabrielle: Yeah, you know, I don't do it often, but like under my nightstand right now, I have a basket of all of my volumes of journals that I've moved through in the last five years, five plus years. And sometimes I will kind of just go back and reflect, just to see what I was saying, especially like with the women that I work with in my coaching business, like it is helpful for me that I did document so much of it, because then I can really understand things about them. So that's kind of what leads me to do it. But then I get into it, I'm like, oh, yeah this is what I was thinking and feeling. So yeah, I do some reflection sometimes, but it also just feels like in me I don't know like it's like that version. It just it [00:53:00] feels close, you know, so.
Karrie: Well, Gabrielle, we have loved talking with you today, and we wanted to give you the chance to let our listeners know how they can connect with you. We will put all your links in the show notes, but if you have anything going on right now or just a way if people want to learn more about your work, where can they find you?
Gabrielle: Yeah, well, I'm on Instagram at Gabrielle Westbrook, and I also am on TikTok. I kind of do different content on both, so if you are someone who is really maybe going through healing betrayal, or you don't know where to start. You're looking for some safety and connection, TikTok is going to be the place you want to go. It's the same, just at Gabrielle Westbrook. And then on Instagram, I talk about more variety of healing topics. And right now how people can work with me is through Afterglow, which is my support group and mentorship group. I kind of leave it as a take what you need kind of group. So you can join. It's pretty flexible. You can join as you want to. You can leave as you want to. It's run in a [00:54:00] group setting. So we do two group calls a month. We focus on one specific topic each month to try to keep it really simple. And we sometimes have guest workshop from different experts. We have an amazing private community channel where like, that's the magic of the group, that's where it lives. So yeah, those are mainly the three places that I'm at right now. I am in a, speaking of what we talked about before, like I went through massive burnout at the end of last year. And so I've been recovering from burnout. I'm shifting my business in a lot of ways. I've been doing one on one coaching for the last four and a half years, and I actually have as of this month transitioned out of that. So that's very new and very weird for me to not be promoting that right now. But yeah, we're in a transition phase, so it's exciting.
Dominique: Oh, that's beautiful. Thank you so much. Wow. What powerful work you have done over the years are continuing to do and what a powerful support system you provide for those out there in need through the community and whatever you end up offering in the future, I am just thrilled to [00:55:00] hear more about how things are transitioning for you in time.
Gabrielle: Thank you. Thank you. Well, thank you for having me. And I know Karrie and I have connected so often on Instagram, so it's so nice to meet you too, Dominique, and be able to just chat with you both. And thanks for just holding space for me to share. It's been exciting. It's been fun.
Dominique: Absolutely. This is lovely. Thank you.
Gabrielle: Thanks.
Karrie: Thank you for listening to this episode. Your support is so appreciated.
Dominique: If you'd like to have a question answered about your Human Design or Enneagram type in a future episode, you can submit it through the link in the show notes. We'd love to hear from you.
